On the matter of the library

What a rousing debate this has become! It is certainly enjoyable.

Brax, your arguments have not been given any pillars upon which to stand. You keep insisting upon the certain employment of this exclusionary tactic, but you have not yet told us why an establishment that - by your own words - does not seek a profit would engage in such behaviour when other types of establishments would not. At the moment, we have nothing but your self-proclaimed intelligence and "they should not be run at a profit" as evidence, which do not logically lead to the conclusion that librarians would restrict  access to other libraries.

Why would you refuse to give the password to the library to scholars if you knew it, when you have also said that the information contained therein should be free to any? This is contradictory.

Furthermore, you have stated you would require payment to assist the scholars of Travance in stocking the library, as your time is valuable. Why, then, is mine not? Why should I expected to do these things for the benefit of Travance, to contribute my time and money to a library, without compensation? Is it due to some noble quality you have assigned to me? If so, I must both thank you for the compliment and humbly deny its assertions.

I look forward to reading your clarifications of these contradictory statements. I also have to wonder if you realize the full implications of the statements you have been making.

To address everyone else who has been reading this, I hope you do not think that the only way to monetize a library is to charge for access to the books. Please do not make the assumption that I am in any way trying to restrict access to information to the law-abiding citizens of Travance.

Father Haroldson, I can think of several professions whose members I would personally not want anywhere near my books. I am sure with a minimum amount of effort you can think of some, as well. You have made your dislike of the Mage's Guild quite obvious in the past, and I do have to wonder if this has colored your opinion on the location of Loremaster Belegchand's arcane codices. Of course, we could have additional codices, available in another location. This would also ensure that if one of the books was somehow lost or the building itself was destroyed, the information would still be easily available.

-Lois

Lois, while my dislike for certain aspects of the Mages Guild is well known, it is also true that Guildmaster Silverbow and I have a great deal of personal respect for one another.  Indeed, I employ his personal services in matters of the Church, when allowed, and for most of my personal projects as well.  No mage has been refused admittance to the library to my knowledge.  Unless a profession is banned from Travance, they have a right to the knowledge contained in general works.  I might restrict specific works, such as those relating to the Church, to those baptized to the Light, and those referring to dangerous creature to those who have a demonstrated ability to handle the attention such knowledge attracts, but those are very specific instances and apply to very few of the works on hand.

Lois,
   I would like to start with restating my previous question which has yet to be answered. Whom is the second Barbarian whom was arguing over books, I see myself and Templar Nightwing but he was not arguing with me, so please pray tell whom is this second Barbarian?

Now with that out of the way allow me to respond to your statements.

Why am I against a second library. It is unnecessary it is frivolous. It is in my belief bad for the barony and would restrict the dissemination of knowledge. And yes libraries should not be run at a profit. For doing so encourages graft avarice and puts this with meager finances at an unsafe disadvantage against those with greater finances... Insert an argument against Fr. Haroldson because he is a man of great means. Yes he is a man of great means but he has proven himself to be a great philanthropist and so any argument that could be made on that point is invalid.
A for my self proclaimed intelligence. Yes I claim I am of not insignificant or lessened intelligence. Volume of learned knowledge is no basis for measuring intelligence nor is it. Basis for measuring intellect. This is where one might argue " but you yourself said you are just a dumb Barbarian" to which my rebuttal is "you are obviously unfamiliar with sarcasm"
IF I knew the password to the library which I do not, I would not give it out to anyone not just to a scholar who might ask. Doing this is not a restriction of knowledge. I would not give it out because it would not be my place to give it out. If someone wished to know the password to do research it would be THEIR personal responsibility to find out what it is. Not mine to hold their hand and help them with a profession which is not my own. I would not ask a Mage about how to be a Warrior. I would not expect a scholar to ask a Warrior about scholarly things. Yes I said the information should be free. The ability to access it is not my place to approve or disapprove.
You expect me to put my life and limb in danger to help you be a scholar yet refuse me compensation for the danger I put myself into. Do not expect my assistance. Last I checked a paper cut was not as dangerous as a troupe of Forrest trolls. No I do not believe you should be compensated by ME for providing more volumes to the baronial library that is for the count or the baron to reward you for such. If I were to purchase a scroll ballad canticle or plasm from you well then yes I would compensate you.. For the essence you expended to create the commodity. Just as I do when I purchase clothing from Seamstress or luxuries from one of our many gypsies or new shoes from our cobbler or food from one of our many bakers or chefs or farmers.
And yes I do understand the full implications of what I am saying. Furthermore I disbelieve that a library should be run at a profit for that would place it under the jurisdiction of the merchants guild and by that very jurisdiction it creates an imbalance and prevents any who seek knowledge from obtaining it within the law. Now if you or anyone else would like to make an arrangement with Fr. Haroldosn or Mr. Amizar  about selling your scholarly wares through the library we have that is a conversation you must have with them... Or whomever the current proprietor of the baronial library is.
Returning to the topic of time and money. Were I a scholar I would donate my tomes and codescies et al to the library as an act of philanthropy however any scrolls ectectect I made would be to be sold such that I had funding for paper and ink to create more volumes to add to the library. And again were I a scholar and wanted to go out on an adventure to find funding for my work exclusive of mercantilism I would expect to be required to pay the person I hired as an escort. Or if I was unwilling to do that I would take my chances on going out alone.
If you continue to insist I am being contradictory then I can only presume you are doing such to continue not debate but argument for it's own sake to which I will not participate.

Fr. Haroldson, Fr. Osred, Mr. Amizar, your Grace the Count, I offer myself and my skill as a craftsman in the construction of the new library building such that it may be a free and open repository of wisdom for the people of our barony.

Father Haroldson, thank you for clearing that up. It seems we are both in agreement that some people should be denied access, though it is a much smaller number than those who should be allowed: denial to those of illegal professions (if they exist), and perhaps sub-categories of other professions such as dark priests seeking to access works concerning the church of light. These are, however, philosophical matters; practically speaking, it would simply be best for all involved to have duplicates of certain specific works such as a codex of the arcane. I will do my best to alleviate this difficulty.

Brax, you still have not answered my first question, which is how you are so certain librarians, being normally of a temperament to share information, would try to restrict access to other libraries.

The rest of what you said is irrelevant to me, as it is addressing points which I have not made. However, I have spotted what seems to be at the root of your misconceptions: your belief that the control of a library would rest ultimately with the Merchant's Guild, and that generating income is the same as functioning for profit (You may wish to read Father Haroldson's manuscript on economics for some more in-depth information on the latter point.). Let us see if you, or perhaps some of the other readers, can spot the flaw in your reasoning. This entire debate may make an excellent study aid when I next teach more advanced logic.

As for your question of two barbarians arguing, if it is that important to you, perhaps you should go knock on the door of the Dragon's Claw and ask Jonas what he meant.

I would pay the rest of your points more individual attention, but I have a terrible paper-cut, and alas, all I can muster are these scant few paragraphs! Perhaps I should go and fight some forest trolls, so that my time can be counted as worthwhile as yours.

-Lois

Lois, it ill becomes you to denigrate one of a person's professions.  If people such as Fr. Brax and I, not mentioning hundreds of others who do so as well, did not keep the enemies of Travance at bay, others who lead mainly sedate life would be forced to learn how to adequately defend themselves.  I distinctly recall our first meeting.

Lois,
   I am sorry that my posts are either too verbose or Cerebrally obtuse.
Let me use smaller and less difficult words.

We have a perfectly good library
We do not need another
A for profit library would fall under the jurisdiction of the merchants guild
This is bad
It by definition in terms excluding
It is counter to the sharing of knowledge
Who am I so certain two libraries in competition would be to the detriment of the people?
Personal
Political
Financial agenda above and beyond the mission of sharing knowledge and wisdom.
As for economics and logic my grasp of each is sound and par excellence.
As for addressing points you have not made.
I was addressing and responding to points you or others might make pre-emptively.

Allow me to say that I am impressed at the length of this discussion.  If you took all the flyers & papers posted here, it could well become it's own book.

I would like to know, from someone with an official capacity to speak, is there a law barring the creation of another library?

There are no laws preventing private citizens from establishing their own collections of books. Such a law would be absurd.

Lord Abendroth

Such a conversation might even be absurd!

Who knows, though?

I would be interested in knowing how having two collections of knowledge would reduce the dissemination of same. As a fair few citizens could tell you, every time a person shares a bit of knowledge, the person shared with usually wants to share it with someone else.

The way I see it, if the two libraries chose to compete for whose collection was more complete, they would have to throw open their doors to prove their relative status. If they chose to collaborate, then we might very well end up with more copies of common information, so that it can be distributed to the people more readily, and more hiding places for the sensitive knowledge. Neither possibility strikes me as a bad thing.

As far as approaching a Scholar for Scholarly questions, etc., I'm sure we are all aware that for a professional Scholar, at the very least, the quest for knowledge takes them into the realm of all types of people, because that is where the knowledge comes from. The specialized knowledge that comes with trades, or the language and guarded secrets of both common and long-forgotten races, that comes most readily from its true source: the people who made that knowledge to begin with. Thus, a Scholar might be seen approaching anyone for knowledge, and hopefully spreading that knowledge once they've mastered it. We all might learn that lesson well... and I fear I've spent a lot of time talking to Chroniclerites these past few moons; their words are rubbing off on me.

I do hope my opinion doesn't offend; this seemed like such a spirited and interesting debate, and I wanted to offer my thoughts.

As I've said before: information is valuable, communication invaluable.

There is no law against having two libraries.

As to how having more than one would prevent the dissemination of knowledge, it would not, unless duplicates were made of some works before first copies on other topics were penned.  That would impair the availability of some unknown knowledge of reaching the public.  As to the dissemination of knowledge, I place mine in codices and manuscripts as fast as I can write them.  Other scholars seem to have other agendas.  Perhaps you should take a look at the works in the library and see for yourself. 

I cannot speak for the other scholars, but I know when a topic grabs my interest I travel where I must and speak to whom I am able until such time as I have enough information to allow my MS to be written.  My tastes are eclectic and eccentric, leading me to such diverse topics as Kromyrian politics, canon law, etiquette, undead chamions, to hearaldry.  Who knows what some will find useful.  It all forms a patten for me and I try to fill in what I need to make my picture more comlete.  I dearly wish others would also share some of their knowledge.  Alas, some like Dr. Darkwod are too busy.  It is good that I have so much spare time and am never called to perorm any services, else I too, would be to busy.

Since there is no law against it & this looks to be a matter dealing with merchants, then I see no reason for all this back-&-forth. As for some of the tones of the messages, I am surprised by how heated & personal some of this has become.  My only hope is that while matters like this are worthy of attention & thought, let's not forget other matters that are still pressing.  A war & many battles still continue in far off areas.  Seeding, planting & harvesting must still be done.  Old threats remain.  Our brave lords & ladies have turned their attention to other matters, & let's not lose focus on what is pending.

Thank you for your time.

You seem to miss the point while underscoring it, squire.  The point is libraries are believed by some to ill-serve the public if they are merchant enterprises.

I have not missed the point.  I am aware of it quite well.  I just wonder why all the back-&-forth.  If one truly feels strongly about this, then entreat our Lords & Ladies to take action & make a law or speak to the Chancellor of Trade about making changes in policy.  I see more words & not actions taking place.  I had hoped that the wise folks here are sending private missives to each other & to our respective leaders, that is all.

It is nt wisdom to have an independent library (system) be put under the control of those who did little or nothing to sustainb, maintain, and protect the library.  A law is not required, unless one loves bureacratic systems imposed by those who are not part of the system..  The current library is free, and thus is not at all part or answerable to any bureau save the Count.  Now that you are part of the bureacracy, you seem to deire everything run through those who have had little, if any, contact with the institution in question.

You are correct that I desire to have everything run through the bureaucracy that is our government.  When I was not Squire'd, I had no care of what happened within the ruling of the lands.  It was because I had no stake in the matters of court.  Now that I have been Squire'd, I have responsibilities & must change my ways.  Much like a new parent, I must place my decisions based on new concerns.  With this new family, there must be new trust & faith.  I must trust & have faith in our Lords & Ladies to lead us & make wise decisions.

To take your words "thus is not at all part or answerable to any bureau save the Count."  So if the Count appoints someone to handle matters, like Lords & Ladies, is it not the same as the Count handling matters?  For handing control over to someone who had no hand in it's creation, maintenance could be seen as a bad idea.  They won't care for it as someone who did.  Or they could treat it with unbiased neutrality & make decisions that aren't influenced by personal feelings.

I only ask that if people feel strongly about this, then turn your energy towards making the changes you wish to see.

This is quite amazing to watch unfold! This all started as one mans idea and blossomed into a storm of wills and opinions. However we cannot forget this was all simply one mans idea. In my short time here I have seen posts on this wall about threats to life as we know it, monsters and executions and very few have reached the attention of citizens  much as this one has. I say if this man has some form of idea that can raise our economy and also create more jobs and promote the spread of knowledge why stop him. We can learn from both and there is nothing forcing people to go to one or the other. Also if Lord Apollo said this wasn't illegal what do any of our opinions matter...he was asking for help, not why he should or shouldn't do it.

Brax, in all of this, you have said one thing that I agree with in its entirety: your statements are cerebrally obtuse.

Father Haroldson, my point was precisely that no one should be denigrating each other's professions, as Brax has been doing to the one you and I share by claiming his time is worth coin and ours is not. Since you missed it, I will elaborate. For you, at least, I know I do not have to tone the discussion down. We will begin with a summation of the declarations put forward by Brax, and proceed assuming they are all correct.

Statement A: It is not Brax's duty to assist others in differing professions.
B: It is the duty of scholars to stock the library.
C: Libraries should not attempt to generate a profit.
Any money generated by a library would put it under the purview of the Merchant's Guild.
E: Being under the influence of the Merchant's Guild "prevents any who seek knowledge from obtaining it within the law."

There are also a few statements to which no one here has particularly objected:
F: Books cost money.
G: Books are valuable.
H: The flow of information should not be restricted.

From B and F follows J*: Scholars must spend money to carry out their duty. Granted, this is the case for many professions. However, when a warrior goes out into the woods, they occasionally come back with things of value to compensate them for their efforts. Indeed, as our former Chancellor of Trade has said many a time, the economy of Travance has traditionally been based almost entirely upon this method of income generation. When a scholar writes a book, though, they lose rather than gain.

D and E are also interesting statements. Taken with J, we have K: any attempt by scholars to gain monetary compensation for stocking the library makes obtaining knowledge through the library illegal. K contradicts H, or K -> ¬H.

Since ¬H cannot be allowed to take place, we must work backwards. H -> ¬K. K is   comprised of J (or B x F) and (D x E). All it really takes to create ¬K is for B, D, E, or F to be false. ¬F is unlikely to occur until ink starts to pour like rain and scholars can twirl their pens once to create an entire tome. Since this leave B, D, or E to be false, that means at least one of Brax's statements must be false. This then contradicts our original assumption, which is that everything Brax says is true. P --> ¬Q, if you'd like to be classical about it.

I could end here, of course, and leave it to everyone else to decide which of his statements are true and which are false, but I think we can all see that at least E is ridiculous, because that would mean the operations of the Merchant's Guild are illegal. As for D, not every source of income in the lands of Travance falls under the jurisdiction of the Merchant's Guild. Since no one has approached the barony asking for permits, we cannot know the end result. It is equally likely that the barony, or the lord of the land in which the library would reside, would declare it a public works project and not subject to the Merchant's Guild, as they would declare it not. Additionally, it is quite possible to have an establishment that attempts to generate income merely as a way to cover its operating costs, with any additional funds set aside for a later date or given to some other organization (such as the treasury of the land within which it exists). This is an entirely different concept than running for profit, which implies the people in charge would be attempting to generate more income than is necessary and putting the excess in their own pockets.

I return now to A. This is a somewhat disturbing statement, as it implies that either L (Brax's time is worth more than a scholar's time) or M (no one of any profession should be assisting others of a differing profession in carrying out their duties without compensation). While L is merely distasteful and mildly insulting, M is quite dangerous. Since Brax has also said that he is aware of the full implications of his statements, I can only hope that no one else agrees with A, and that he will not mind when, if he ever finds himself in need of anything I do such as battlefield first aid, I relieve him of some of the coins in his purse.

The more astute among you have possibly realized that I have not used C and G. I have not forgotten. C is a matter of personal philosophy, but as Lord Apollo has stated, there is nothing in the law that prevents it from occurring. In the case of G, I direct the following to anyone reading along who agrees with some of the other commenters posting here who find this entire debate useless. Because G, this debate is worth having. However, no one is forcing you to read it.

-Lois

*I am aware I skipped I. The prior sentence should be enough to illustrate Y.

I declare Lois Maxwell the champion of this debate. Trophy to follow.


Lord Abendroth

Squire Radley wrote:  "I must trust & have faith in our Lords & Ladies to lead us & make wise decisions."  As mst we all, however as we are all aware such is not alwys the case, particularly when said decisions are made by those with no understanding of the particulars of the matter at hand.  Squire, do you know the average cost of a manuscript, codex, or tome?  Those I have made are all leather bound and use first rate parchment and good ink. 
I would in no wise want someone making decisions on such works without any obligations to preserve the same.

While that adds a bid to the cost, it also significantly adds to the work's shelf life.

Lois, I am exhausted after my match in Loez.  After I rest a bit I will parse your last and reply.

Lois,
   At no point did I ever say the merchants guild was illegal. You are putting words into my mouth. Please stop.
   I never said my time and effort as a warrior was more valuable than yours as a scholar.
   I stated that both have value.
   If you want me to protect you while you go out adventuring I expect monetary reimbursement just as you should for the essence required to create psalms, scrolls, canticles, and ballads.
   The above statement does not claim inference or declare that I would demand all that which was recovered in said adventure. Only a fair share.
   Example, 4 scholars ask myself to escort them on a journey into the wood in search of lost satchels. On the way 7 lizard kin attack us. I dispatch them. I would expect To receive the specie from said lizard kin while giving the 4 scholars any thing else discovered provided it did not fall under the jurisdiction of the church such as altars, fonts, holy symbols ect. On this adventure 4 satchels are found. I would be more than happy to let each scholar take a satchel even if I had found one of them. For I had recieved the specie from the defeated lizard kin.
In a different senario no satchels are found but the 7 lizard kin were still fought and dispatched. I would share equally with the 4 scholars.
   En redux: my time is of value, my martial ability is of value. Your scrolls are of value. If you wish to have me help you collect finances for your scrolls then I must be compensated fairly.
   Now about the cost of creating tomes manuscripts and codescies. While I acknowledge the value of the knowledge and wisdom they hold. They in an of themselves do not have a monetary value. Not on the open market. They do in so much as the cost of parchment, ink and binding. These expenses are the cost of your profession just as for mine it is the cost of getting new armor and weapons made, or having the ones I have repaired, balanced,  honed, and girded. it is the "cost of doing business" if you wish to create tomes ect. Then you must pay the cost. If you wish to fund this by adventuring as opposed to selling scrolls then that is your prerogative. If on your fund finding adventure you ask me to escort. Then I as stated above expect to be reimbursed fairly for putting myself in harms way for you. Or as I have stated previously you can take your chances on adventuring alone.
   Another point where you put words in my mouth which I again ask you to stop is where you mistakenly though that a library having it's own source of income and a library making a profit were one and the same. On this you are factually wrong. Again as a result of your hubris and putting words in my mouth. If the library were to break even or function at a loss (which as far as I know it has been doing another NOT to the detriment of the barony) I would not see it as falling under the jurisdiction of th merchants guild. However were it to make a profit then it would then fall under the jurisdiction of the merchants guild. And I from a moral and ethical stand point see that as being bad and would be to the detriment of the people.
   Again never have I mentioned illegality aside from correcting you on where you mistakenly used it.
   For those who have not been able to follow me I will make things more clear
A: it is not my duty to assist others in their profession with out fair compensation for time and effort
B: it is the duty of scholars to stock the library
C: libraries should not generate a profit
any profits generated by the library would cause it to fall under the jurisdiction of the merchants guild
E: being under the jurisdiction of the merchants guild could and likely would interfere if not prevent the flow of knowledge, wisdom and information to and throughout the people's of the barony (no mention of legality... Again stop putting words into my mouth)
F: books cost money
G: expense of creating books is the cost of doing business which the scholar having chosen to Pen said book has volunteered to bare.
H: the information contained within books is valuable
I: the flow of information should not be restricted.

The harder you try and work and fight and the more faulty circular logic you try to use to prove me wrong, while commendable in your tenacity, only strengthens my stance that I am correct, in that we do not need a second library, and libraries that function to produce a profit are to the detriment of the people's of the barony.

Brax, it seems as if you are making poor decisions in regards to your time. If you require compensation from someone asking a favor of you, then ask it, if they cannot provide it.. then do not assist them.

Other then that, I'm having an issue seeing the other notes of interest on this posting board due to the extreme clutter from this one. I pity whomever has to tidy this thing up.

Brax' points are very clear to me, and bring up a point which is all too prevelant in our town.  To wit, the hangers on who attach themselves, unofficially to a fighter during one of the many combats which occur during a typical segment of time in Travance.  The fighter type dispatches the marauding creature(s).  The fighter type continues to fight said marauders, while non-combants loot the fallen bodies for valuables, weapons, and essences, giving no heed or (usually) or portion to those who killed the creature, regardless of need, 

I realize this is straying far from the topic at hand (well, not so far from an ethical point of view), but it all ties in to the concept of making a living from penning one's books (something I personally have not consdiered, but then, I have the means to spend many baronial notes and much gold for the betterment of the library.  This is one of those areas in which my contributions, to highlight a comment by the Chancellor of Trade, are taken for granted by most.

Should a scholar desire to be compensated for the materials used in the consturction of their works, there are ways.  Indeed, for a few months I was hiring scholars at 2-3 gold per hour to perform research for the church and myself.  Interest did not maintain itself, so I ceased. 

If it's the cost of the books, manuscripts, etc... is your concern, then maybe a mercantile basis for the library would be a good thing?  You were hiring scholars yourself at one point, making it a business. The authors & owners would be recouped in the cost of making such if they charge for people to read or get access to the works.

If your other concern is as you said... "such is not alwys the case, particularly when said decisions are made by those with no understanding of the particulars of the matter at hand." , then do as I stated before.  Speak with the Count, the Baron or with any of the appointed Lords & Ladies & tell them.  That for all the accomplishments, hard work or whatever merits the person has done, it does NOT deem them worthy to be in charge of the matter at hand.

Squire radley,
    Charging money for access to the resources within the library is one of the exact things I am so adamantly against. It by it's very nature severely hinders if not prevents the dissemination of information to the people. And Fr. Haroldson was paying scholars to aid in his research in the more rapid production of resources for the library. Not to help him encourage his personal financial endeavors.

I remain morally and ethically opposed to a for profit library. However if someone wishes to spend the thousands upon thousands of gold to have one built and stocked more power to them... However I still believe it to be wasteful when that money could be spent to add to the library we already have.  To put it bluntly a second library would be redundant and redundancy stifles the economy. In spite of the short term boost to masons and carpenters and those who would make the ink and paper and bind the books.

Squire - you write that m hiring scholars to assist in research makes it a business.  You have no idea about what constitutes a business, or the smallest clue about Travancian Economics.  I offered scholars gold to assist in my research to have it go faster, because I could afford it, and because it allowed me to follow many lines at one time. I'll leave the noble endeavors to those of proper title - you leave the operation and maintenance of the library to the librarian.

Moira,
   The scenario I was referring to was hypothetical. Please do not question my decision making abilities unless you are concerned for my sanity or if you are claiming I am for some reason incapable of doing my own job. If the latter we have a problem which needs to be resolved, and I do not wish to have a problem with you or any of your kin.
    Now that being said, if you do not have anything constructive or productive to say please refrain from commenting.

Brax,

I'm unsure as to the extent of economics training you may have received being weaned in a barbarian horde. "Redundancy" is by no means stifling in any industry. Competition breeds innovation.

Do your people even have books? By what qualifications are you making these wild statements? Lois Maxwell assuredly received the finest in Londish education, and while her people may have odd preconceptions about the world, I guarantee you she knows books and math better than you could ever hope to.

What sort of sorcery are you employing to appear so literate? At this point I'm skeptical as to your barbarian heritage. Additionally, how dare you address any citizen in such a fashion. You have no title to call your own, and will apologize to Moira.

Fr. Edwin: Guard your words. You come dangerously close to besmirching the Squire Radley. Were I he, I would take umbrage to your statements.

To the gentleman looking to start some sort of academy: I would be pleased to sponsor such an establishment in Drega'mire, and would be interested in funding a complete library for its use. Our people are primarily of the faith of Chronicler, Brazen, and Galladel, and well suited to staffing and utilizing these facilities.

Lord Abendroth

Lord Abendroth,
   I learned the concepts of supply and demand in my native north. I have learned the finer points of economics both on a small and large scale here in Travance and on my trips to Loez.
   My people keep records so yes we have books.
I have never suggested that Lois Maxwell was less educated than I. I never claimed to have any qualifications beyond my own experience and belief on the subject.
    I assure you your lordship I use no sorcery to appear so literate. I have been educated in higher and more in depth literacy since becoming a priest.
   The title I call my own is Priest of Galladel and High Cheiftan of My tribe.
    Lord Abendroth, I did not mean to insult the gypsy girl after she said something to me that could have been insulting and I was trying to clarify what exactly she meant. Moirya if I have stated something that you have taken offense from please forgive me As I meant no offense. And do not see what or where my words could have been insulting.
   

Just to make sure...the gentleman that started this chain of postings...isn't he...a barbarian?